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Post by Panda on Jun 25, 2010 22:02:25 GMT 1
Similar idea to the Football League list I compile.
This is a list of of teams that have played in the World Cup based on their average finishing position.
Teams have been given a finishing position for each tournament from 1930 to 2006. Where teams exit at the same stage, positions are determined by margin of defeat, and for group stages, points, goal difference and goals scored.
Only teams who have appeared in the finals at least 3 times appear on the list.
Each team's highest ranking for a tournament is in first set of brackets. Number of appearances in finals is in second brackets.
1. Germany average = 3.875 (includes West Germany) (1) (16) 2. Brazil 4.944 (1) (18) 3. Italy 5.563 (1) (16) 4. England 6.750 (1) (12) 5. Argentina 7.429 (1) (14) 6. Holland 7.750 (2) (8) 7. France 8.333 (1) (12) 8. Sweden 8.455 (2) (11) 9. Hungary 8.778 (2) (9) 10. Spain 9.000 (4) (12) 11. Romania 9.429 (7) (7) 12. Uruguay 9.600 (1) (10) 13. Serbia 9.900 (includes Yugoslavia) (4) (10) 14. Switzerland 10.125 (5) (8) 15. Czech Republic 10.333 (includes Czechoslovakia) (2) (9) 15. Russia 10.333 (includes USSR) (4) (9) 17. Ireland 10.667 (8) (3) 18. Austria 11.143 (3) (7) 19. Portugal 11.25 (3) (4) 19. Peru 11.25 (7) (4) 21. Chile 11.286 (3) (7) 22. Mexico 11.769 (7) (13) 23. Poland 12.143 (3) (7) 24. Paraguay 12.286 (8) (7) 25. Denmark 12.333 (6) (3) 26. Belgium 12.364 (4) (11) 27. Northern Ireland 13.000 (8) (3) 28. Norway 14.333 (12) (3) 29. Bulgaria 14.429 (4) (7) 30. Bolivia 15.333 (12) (3) 31. Scotland 16.000 (9) (8) 31. Croatia 16.000 (3) (3) 33. Colombia 16.25 (11) (4) 33. Morocco 16.25 (10) (3) 35. USA 16.375 (3) (8) 36. Nigeria 17.333 (10) (3) 37. Cameroon 18.000 (6) (5) 38. South Korea 18.429 (4) (7) 39. Iran 19.333 (14) (3) 40. Costa Rica 22.000 (16) (3) 41. Tunisia 22.250 (9) (4) 42. Japan 23.667 (12) (3) 43. Saudi Arabia 25.750 (14) (4)
This list will be updated after the World Cup. Australia, Algeria and South Africa will be added to the list.
Teams with less than 3 finals appearances: Australia (13) (2) South Africa (17) (2) Algeria (13) (2) Turkey (3) (2) North Korea (7) (1) Ghana (16) (1) Egypt (13) (2) Honduras (18) (1) Ecuador (12) (2) Ivory Coast (19) (1) El Salvador (16) (2) New Zealand (23) (1) Greece (24) (1) Slovenia (30) (1) Wales (5) (1) East Germany (6) (1) Senegal (6) (1) Cuba (8) (1) Ukraine (8) (1) Israel (12) (1) Indonesia (15) (1) (as Dutch East Indies) Haiti (15) (1) Democratic Rep. of Congo (16) (1) (as Zaire) Kuwait (21) (1) Jamaica (22) (1) Iraq (23) (1) Angola (23) (1) Canada (24) (1) United Arab Emirates (24) (1) Trinidad & Tobago (27) (1) Togo (30) (1) China (31) (1)
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frag
Member
*Paranoid Android*
I have no idea what you're talking about, so here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.
Posts: 25,375
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Post by frag on Jun 26, 2010 0:26:00 GMT 1
Nice work.
It'll be interesting to see the number of appearances as well as the highest, as this gives a better indication of who might jump up/slide down.
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Post by Panda on Jun 26, 2010 0:36:59 GMT 1
Nice work. It'll be interesting to see the number of appearances as well as the highest, as this gives a better indication of who might jump up/slide down. Updated!
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Post by Shireblogger on Jun 26, 2010 7:44:20 GMT 1
And here's the All-Time Points list, not including 2010.
Points have been re-set to 3 for a win, 1 for a draw, at all stages of the tournament (i.e. not just group games).
Matches won or lost on penalties are scored as a draw. Where teams are equal on points, they are ranked according to goal difference and then goals scored.
I use the same country combinations as misterhamster (e.g. West Germany and Germany combined).
This list will also be updated at the end of the tournament.
1 (1) - Brazil :: 206 2 (2) - Germany (West) :: 184 3 (3) - Italy :: 151 4 (4) - Argentina :: 112 5 (5) - England :: 92 6 (6) - France :: 85 7 (7) - Spain :: 78 8 (10) - Sweden :: 61 9 (12) - Holland :: 58 10 (8) - Russia / USSR :: 57 11 (9) - Serbia / Yugoslavia :: 56 12 (11) - Uruguay :: 55 13 (14) - Poland :: 50 14 (13) - Hungary :: 48 15 (15) - Mexico :: 45 16 (18) - Czech Rep / Czechoslovakia :: 41 17 (16) - Austria :: 40 18 (17) - Belgium :: 39 19 (23) - Portugal :: 34 20 (19) - Romania :: 29 21 (24) - Switzerland :: 29 22 (20) - Chile :: 27 23 (22) - Paraguay :: 25 24 (21) - Denmark :: 23 25 (25) - United States of America :: 21 26 (28) - Croatia :: 20 27 (26) - Cameroon :: 19 28 (27) - Scotland :: 19 29 (32) - South Korea :: 19 30 (29) - Bulgaria :: 17 31 (30) - Turkey :: 16 32 (31) - Peru :: 15 33 (33) - Republic of Ireland :: 14 34 (34) - Northern Ireland :: 14 35 (35) - Nigeria :: 13 36 (36) - Colombia :: 11 37 (38) - Morocco :: 10 38 (37) - Costa Rica :: 10 39 (51) - Ecuador :: 9 40 (39) - Norway :: 9 41 (40) - Senegal :: 8 42 (41) - East Germany :: 8 43 (42) - Japan :: 8 44 (44) - Saudi Arabia :: 8 45 (N) - Ukraine :: 7 46 (43) - Algeria :: 7 47 (47) - Tunisia :: 7 48 (45) - Wales :: 6 49 (N) - Ghana :: 6 50 (46) - South Africa :: 6 51 (57) - Australia :: 5 52 (50) - Iran :: 5 53 (48) - North Korea :: 4 54 (49) - Cuba :: 4 55 (N) - Ivory Coast :: 3 56 (52) - Jamaica :: 3 57 (53) - Honduras :: 2 58 (N) - Angola :: 2 59 (54) - Israel :: 2 60 (55) - Egypt :: 2 61 (56) - Kuwait :: 1 62 (N) - Trinidad & Tobago :: 1 63 (58) - Bolivia :: 1 64 (59) - Iraq :: 0 65 (60) - Slovenia :: 0 66 (N) - Togo :: 0 67 (61) - Canada :: 0 68 (62) - Dutch East Indies :: 0 69 (63) - United Arab Emirates :: 0 70 (64) - China :: 0 71 (65) - New Zealand :: 0 72 (66) - Greece :: 0 73 (67) - Haiti :: 0 74 (68) - Zaire :: 0 75 (69) - El Salvador :: 0
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Post by Shireblogger on Jun 26, 2010 7:59:09 GMT 1
All-Time Goal Difference, prior to 2010:-
1 - Brazil :: +117 2 - Germany (West) :: +78 3 - Italy :: +53 4 - Argentina :: +39 5 - France :: +31 6 - Hungary :: +30 7 - England :: +27 8 - Spain :: +23 9 - Netherlands :: +21 10 - Russia / USSR :: +20
19 - Senegal :: +1 [Best African] 20 - Republic of Ireland :: 0 22 - Wales :: 0 26 - Honduras :: -1 [Best CONCACAF] 36 - Iraq :: -3 [Best Asian] 58 - Northern Ireland :: -10 67 - Scotland :: -16
70 - El Salvador :: -21 71 - Saudi Arabia :: -23 72 - USA :: -24 73= South Korea :: -31 73= Bulgaria :: -31 75 - Mexico :: -36
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Post by Panda on Jun 26, 2010 23:04:24 GMT 1
Nice work, SB.
I'm sure I read somewhere that England hold the record for the most drawn games in the World Cup finals.
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Post by Shireblogger on Jun 26, 2010 23:17:00 GMT 1
I'm sure I read somewhere that England hold the record for the most drawn games in the World Cup finals. Prior to the start of this competition, Italy and Germany shared the lead with 19, followed by England on 17 and Brazil on 14. Most defeats was Mexico (22), then Argentina (19) and Germany (18). England were in 17th place for defeats, with 13. On goals conceded, it is Germany first with 112, then Brazil with 85 and Mexico on 84. England in 18th with 47.
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Post by Panda on Jun 26, 2010 23:22:23 GMT 1
These are the 17-32 rankings for this year's tournament:
17. Ivory Coast 4 (+1) 18. Slovenia 4 (0) 19. South Africa 4 (-2) 20. Australia 4 (-3) 21. New Zealand 3 (0) 22. Switzerland 3 (0) 23. Serbia 3 (-1) 24. Denmark 3 (-3) 25. Greece 3 (-3) 26. Italy 2 (-1) 27. Nigeria 1 (-2) 28. Algeria 1 (-2) 29. France 1 (-3) 30. Honduras 1 (-3) 31. Cameroon 0 (-3) 32. North Korea 0 (-11)
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Post by Panda on Jun 26, 2010 23:23:41 GMT 1
I'm sure I read somewhere that England hold the record for the most drawn games in the World Cup finals. Prior to the start of this competition, Italy and Germany shared the lead with 19, followed by England on 17 and Brazil on 14. Most defeats was Mexico (22), then Argentina (19) and Germany (18). England were in 17th place for defeats, with 13. On goals conceded, it is Germany first with 112, then Brazil with 85 and Mexico on 84. England in 18th with 47. Come to think of it, it may have been highest percentage of drawn games...
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Post by Earl Purple on Jun 27, 2010 1:06:30 GMT 1
Germany conceded 8 goals in a game in 1954 and then went on to win that World Cup beating the same team in the final.
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Post by Panda on Jun 27, 2010 19:46:49 GMT 1
These are the 17-32 rankings for this year's tournament: 17. Ivory Coast 4 (+1) 18. Slovakia 4 (0) 19. South Africa 4 (-2) 20. Australia 4 (-3) 21. New Zealand 3 (0) 22. Switzerland 3 (0) 23. Serbia 3 (-1) 24. Denmark 3 (-3) 25. Greece 3 (-3) 26. Italy 2 (-1) 27. Nigeria 1 (-2) 28. Algeria 1 (-2) 29. France 1 (-3) 30. Honduras 1 (-3) 31. Cameroon 0 (-3) 32. North Korea 0 (-11) 16. England
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Post by paulgilb on Jun 27, 2010 22:32:33 GMT 1
How common is it for a team to go out at the group stage despite a positive goal difference (I know Spain managed it in 1998 and Scotland in 1974)?
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Post by Earl Purple on Jun 28, 2010 9:49:16 GMT 1
Why England 16th?
We already have a better record than South Korea who only got 4 points in their group compared to our 5 and also lost a game 4-1.
And we will have a better record than any other team who got through their group with only 4 points if they lose in the last 16.
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Post by Earl Purple on Jun 28, 2010 9:50:51 GMT 1
How common is it for a team to go out at the group stage despite a positive goal difference (I know Spain managed it in 1998 and Scotland in 1974)? In 1982 Hungary 10-1 vs El Salvador, 1-4 vs Argentina and 1-1 vs Belgium so +6 but everyone else beat El Salvador albeit by smaller scores and as Belgium also surprisingly beat Argentina, they had 5 points, Argentina 4 and Hungary just 3 (with 2 points for a win). USSR in 1990 and Russia in 1994 beat Cameroon by a big scoreline (4-0 and 6-1 respectively). In both tournaments this was after having already lost both their opening games. Although in those years sometimes 3 teams went through from a group, they were bottom in 1990 (Cameroon won the group having won both their opening games) and second bottom in 1994 (Cameroon had 1 point and went out with them), and 3 points was not enough in 1994 for them even as a 3rd-placed team. In the 3 tournaments where some 3rd placed teams qualified, it never happened in Brazil's group.
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Post by Panda on Jun 28, 2010 10:18:49 GMT 1
Why England 16th? We already have a better record than South Korea who only got 4 points in their group compared to our 5 and also lost a game 4-1. And we will have a better record than any other team who got through their group with only 4 points if they lose in the last 16. England lost 4-1. South Korea lost 2-1. The group stage is irrelevant at this point (unless two teams lose by the same scoreline). If someone were to lose by more than 3 goals or by a scoreline of 3-0, they would go below England. Any team that loses on penalties would automatically be placed ahead of a team that lost in normal time.
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Post by Panda on Jun 28, 2010 10:22:00 GMT 1
USSR in 1990 and Russia in 1994 beat Cameroon by a big scoreline (4-0 and 6-1 respectively). In both tournaments this was after having already lost both their opening games. Although in those years sometimes 3 teams went through from a group, they were bottom in 1990 (Cameroon won the group having won both their opening games) and second bottom in 1994 (Cameroon had 1 point and went out with them), and 3 points was not enough in 1994 for them even as a 3rd-placed team. It should be pointed out 1994 was the first World Cup where 3 points were awarded for a win.
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Post by Earl Purple on Jun 28, 2010 21:52:40 GMT 1
Chile are below England then having lost 0-3. Although my ranking would put them higher because they got 6 points in their group...
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Post by Earl Purple on Jun 30, 2010 15:42:30 GMT 1
rankings 9-16 would appear to be:
9 Japan (lost on penalties) 10 USA (lost 1-2 in extra time) 11 Slovakia (lost 1-2) 12 South Korea (lost 1-2) 13 Portugal (lost 0-1) 14 Mexico (lost 1-3) 15 England (lost 1-4) 16 Chile (lost 0-3)
Slovakia had a better record in their group than South Korea (both had 4 points but Slovakia's goal difference was better). I assume losing in extra time is considered better than losing in normal time so USA are above them (but would be anyway on group record).
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Post by Panda on Jul 1, 2010 10:03:07 GMT 1
rankings 9-16 would appear to be: 9 Japan (lost on penalties) 10 USA (lost 1-2 in extra time) 11 Slovakia (lost 1-2) 12 South Korea (lost 1-2) 13 Portugal (lost 0-1) 14 Mexico (lost 1-3) 15 England (lost 1-4) 16 Chile (lost 0-3) Slovakia had a better record in their group than South Korea (both had 4 points but Slovakia's goal difference was better). I assume losing in extra time is considered better than losing in normal time so USA are above them (but would be anyway on group record). Correct.
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Post by Earl Purple on Jul 4, 2010 0:42:02 GMT 1
5. Ghana (lost on penalties) 6. Brazil (lost 1-2) 7. Paraguay (lost 0-1) 8. Argentina (lost 0-4)
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